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Joey01
Bone Stock
Posts:7
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| 09/04/2007 6:31 AM |
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| Hi, I have an 01 4Runner Limited, with a recent transmission cooler and distribution bars added. I bought a camper recently and dry weight is 4100lbs. Book recommends not going over 5k. Since I only have a 6 cly, some people have made comments on whether I should pull the camper long term with it. I don't drive it with water, but have two FULL propane tanks along with no more than 400lbs of passengers not to mention taking food, campgear, etc.(all lightweight of course). 1, can anyone tell me if they have this sort of set up and had no problems 2, can I upgrade from my 6 to an 8 cylindar?
Thanks, Joe |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/04/2007 8:11 AM |
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| The simplest solution here would be to install deeper axle gears. With proper gearing you should be able to pull the weight you have okay. Installing a bigger engine means upgrading cooling and likely tranny too because it will put more strain on drive line. Deep axle gears reduce drive line strain. You can move more weight reliably with a 6 and deep gear than you can with a V8 and taller gears most of the time. |
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Joey01
Bone Stock
Posts:7
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| 09/04/2007 11:55 AM |
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| Snoman, I decided to check out the pricing of having the gears done. I called the RV place where I purchased my camper and this is what I was told. That my truck should be ok pulling my camper and that it's ok for there to be some drag going up a hill. Having the gears done would make my car really suck up gas. I can't decide what I should do. Would you trust the RV service guy. Sounds like he knows what he's talking about, he's seen my truck and installed the tramsmission cooler as well. for an example, i went up a long hill that made my truck go from 70mph to 50mph but stayed steady there. I didn't really give too much more gas, but i didn't have to press it to the floor either. any advice?
Thanks, Joe |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/04/2007 3:32 PM |
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| First of all there is some myth about deeper gears sucking gas. Back in "old days" whne vehicles did not have OD, you tried to compromise gear ratio some to limit engine RPM in drive and help fuel usage a little. Today, all vehicles have OD so even with a deeper gear ratio, when in OD you final drive is pretty tall. If you went one step or so deeper (say from a 3.90 to a 4.38) I doubt you would see any real MPG impact not towing and likely a increase in MPG towing. Rule of thumb, it takes the same HP to move vehicle down the road regardless of engine RPM and the higher the RPM, the more power that is available or in reserve. Another tip, limit towing speed to 60 or 65 tops and drag increase rapidly over 55 or 60 and MPG drops too. And when you climb that hill, let it slow down a bit to a speed it is comfortable at rather than pedal to the metal to race up it because the top of the hill will still be there when you get there and you car will last longer and use less fuel doing it too. |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 09/04/2007 7:11 PM |
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Joey - SnoMan is 101% right on target here. Drop your gears down one notch, and you'll save gas when towing. Further, you'll keep your engine closer to it's max power range, which is where you make the most power with the least amount of fuel.
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
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'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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Joey01
Bone Stock
Posts:7
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| 09/05/2007 7:25 AM |
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| Thanks Rick and SnoMan - after receiving your comments and talking to a couple of mechanics, I should be good with what I have. When I was on the highway and hitting those long hills, i dropped speed down to 50-55 and was right under 3k rpm without pushing on the gas too much. From now on, i'll drop my gear to 2nd to see if that will help as well. It's great to have people that know what they are talking about!
Joey |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/05/2007 11:42 AM |
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| On more tip, for serious towing you want a final drive axle ratio deep enough that you can pull highway grades in drive not second. (use OD for the flats) Drive has most efficient power transfer as it is 1 to 1 and no power or heat loss in reduction gears. If you find yourself hitting second a lot on highway grades you really need a deeper axle ratio. BTW, you axle has you strongest reduction unit in it so exploit it when towing with best ratio combo for work it has to perform and also remember that a deeper axle ratio will also improve backing performance and power when backing a trailer into place. Furthermore 3000 to 3500 RPM is a good RPM to use for extended pulls on long grades |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 09/05/2007 8:03 PM |
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SnoMan keeps beating me to the punch... ;)
Downshifting on occasion is ok, but continued downshifting will destroy your transmission and/or your differential. As SnoMan mentioned, the optimal gear is Drive (1:1) when pushing the pedal down, but if you're having to put the pedal to the floor and it's shifting to second, you should seriously consider lowering your axle gears. It'll save you a bunch in the long run (both in gas, and in transmission bills).
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
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'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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batch
Street Queen
Posts:117
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| 09/05/2007 8:15 PM |
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All,
I would have to disagree. I dont know that simply installing new gears in the rear end is going to cut it. If the towing capacity is 5K and you are pulling around 5K then you are pushing the limits pure and simple.
There are a lot of variables here that we haven't considered (how far you tow, how hilly the area you tow in is, etc.)
Long story short - the V6 in your 4Runner is only putting out 183 HP which has all it can handle just dealing with the 4000 lb curb weight of the truck. Add a 5000 lbs of trailer, cargo and passengers and that 3.4L has a lot of work to do.
The one thing we haven't considered here is brakes. Do you have enough braking power to handle that big of a trailer safely? Having towed it I would suspect that you already know this.
If your budget allows I would consider moving up to a Sequoia. There you get the 240 HP 4.7L V8 and a 6200 LB towing capacity.
The good news is that your 4Runner is still worth between 11 and 14K. You can get into a similar vintage Sequoia in the 15K range if you are willing to step down to an SR5. My guess is that the penalty in gas mileage will be similar to putting gears in your 4Runner and you will come out way ahead of installing a V8. |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 09/05/2007 8:56 PM |
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You made an excellent point about the brakes Mike, as they are often overlooked when towing heavy loads.
However, I'm relatively sure that the axles underneath the 4Runner and the Sequoia are the same, which means they have the same brakes. With the heavier curb weight, you may get the same braking capability, at best.
Also, if you consider moving to a Sequoia, you really need to calculate the power-to-weight ratio, which is as important as the manufacturer claims of towing capacity (which can be a bit like EPA ratings sometimes).
Sequoia Power-to-Weight Ratio...
Your Power:Weight Ratio is 1 : 21.2
This means that for every 21.2 pounds of weight on your vehicle, you have 1 horsepower. So for every 21.2 pounds of weight you remove from your vehicle, you will feel the effects of an additional 1 horsepower, although your actual peak horsepower will not change.
4Runner Power-to-Weight Ratio...
Your Power:Weight Ratio is 1 : 21.9
This means that for every 21.9 pounds of weight on your vehicle, you have 1 horsepower. So for every 21.9 pounds of weight you remove from your vehicle, you will feel the effects of an additional 1 horsepower, although your actual peak horsepower will not change.
All in all - you may get the capacity to tow more weight because of it's larger and more powerful engine, but it's offset by the fact that the Sequoia needs to get on the Hoodia diet when you compare the power to weight ratio.
Nonetheless, Mike made a great point when he addressed the brakes. While you can certainly tow with your 4Runner, be sure to service your brakes OFTEN, and I strongly recommend a trailer with axle brakes.
Regards,
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
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'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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batch
Street Queen
Posts:117
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| 09/05/2007 9:20 PM |
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Ah - foiled by physics. Dammit - that gets me every time.
Two points to consider though grasshoppah.
The first is chassis - The 4Runner is loosely based on the Taco while the Sequoia is pretty closely based on the first generation Tundra. I would have to do some serious digging to find out if they used the same axles and brakes but my guess is that the Taco is configured for lighter duty than the Tundra was.
The second point to consider is torque. While you are correct in noting that the additional 57 ponies in the Sequoia has to push about 1200 more pounds the iForce V8 also brings more than 100 additional lb ft of twist. (315 vs 207). That is what is going to get that trailer moving. At highway rpms (typically around 3000) that is what is going to keep you from downshifting all the time.
None of this matters if a new rig isnt in the budget but in the end the Sequoia is rated to tow more. It could be brakes - it could be motor and it could be driveline. It is likely a little bit of everything. |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/05/2007 9:31 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by batch
I would have to disagree. I dont know that simply installing new gears in the rear end is going to cut it. If the towing capacity is 5K and you are pulling around 5K then you are pushing the limits pure and simple.
Actually if you do the math and select right gears it can cut it. If we follow your logic here completely that he cannot move that weight with his engine effectively then how does a semi move 40 ton with only 300 or 400 HP? GEARS is how as 400 HP in them is not any stronger than 400HP in a car, the only difference is that it is geared to extract max power at different road speeds via ratio selection. (do not play the 1000 ft lb plus torque number either because HP is torque time RPM divided by 5252). OTR motors have to make a lot of torque because some of them cannot even make 2000RPMs
quote:
Originally posted by batch
There are a lot of variables here that we haven't considered (how far you tow, how hilly the area you tow in is, etc.)
True on variables but math can do a lot of that (see link below)
http://forum.snoman.com/viewtopic.php?t=45
quote:
Originally posted by batch
Long story short - the V6 in your 4Runner is only putting out 183 HP which has all it can handle just dealing with the 4000 lb curb weight of the truck. Add a 5000 lbs of trailer, cargo and passengers and that 3.4L has a lot of work to do.
Gee how in the "H" did a tow a full sized 66 dodge on a trailer from Ohio to TN near NC border in 74 with a 66 3/4 ton chevy with a 250 in it??? How? I will tell you how, it had 4.57 gears and it did a fine job of it even on hills with its punny little 155 HP and averaged 11 to 12 MPG too. It is gear ratio that makes or breaks you towing because they determine at what speed you HP is available. I should know as I have been towing for over 35 years now. Also I drove a tri axle dump truck for a summer job going to college in 70's and it had a 427 with a 20 speed and a GVW of 60K so how did its 255 HP move it too? GEARS! I could get up to 65 on highway on reasonable flat ground without too much trouble at 60K GVW (even had it up to 70K a few times on a waiver) Again it is all in the gears.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
The one thing we haven't considered here is brakes. Do you have enough braking power to handle that big of a trailer safely? Having towed it I would suspect that you already know this.
Yes brakes is a concern but that is what they make trailer brakes for duh. Anyone that would travel a lot with a 4 or 5 K trailer without brakes on it behind anything other that a dump truck or the like is foolish.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
If your budget allows I would consider moving up to a Sequoia. There you get the 240 HP 4.7L V8 and a 6200 LB towing capacity.
Factory tow rating should be taken as a relative suggested guide and nothing more. Back in old day when you got a tow package you got some serious gears too but today it is different and that is why I say modify what you have as it will do better than simply getting a V8 powered one.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
The good news is that your 4Runner is still worth between 11 and 14K. You can get into a similar vintage Sequoia in the 15K range if you are willing to step down to an SR5. My guess is that the penalty in gas mileage will be similar to putting gears in your 4Runner and you will come out way ahead of installing a V8.
Again there is no need to sell it as with a little work it could be a fine tow tug for his needs. If he had a bigger trailer I would suggest a bigger truck but his will do fine with a little work. |
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batch
Street Queen
Posts:117
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| 09/05/2007 10:07 PM |
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OK - then maybe he should trade in his 4Runner for a RAV4 and install short gears and an 18 speed transmission. Heck - with that setup he should be able to tow a house.
You are correct that towing ratings are a suggestion (probably a pretty conservative one at that) and that you can exceed them but you do so at your own peril.
I have exceeded the towing capacity of my vehicle as well and I have damaged it in the process. Just because you have done something doesn't make it a good idea.
Of course with the revised gearing you will have to contend with speedo error. Not a big deal but it is worth considering.
I towed my ATV trailer with a 6 cyl Grand Cherokee for several years before buying a full sized truck. I can say without question that it is much easier to tow now than it was then.
I don't know if his trailer has brakes or not. I would assume that it is a tandem axle with brakes at 4100 lbs but he didn't mention a brake controller. They could be surge brakes but again - it wasn't mentioned so i assumed the worst.
I am not faulting your math but given a choice between a small vehicle and a big vehicle to tow a trailer I will take the big vehicle.
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/06/2007 7:57 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by batch
OK - then maybe he should trade in his 4Runner for a RAV4 and install short gears and an 18 speed transmission. Heck - with that setup he should be able to tow a house.
Going a little overboard here..
quote:
Originally posted by batch
You are correct that towing ratings are a suggestion (probably a pretty conservative one at that) and that you can exceed them but you do so at your own peril.
Not had much experience with Toyota tow rating but I can tell you that Detriot's tow rating on 1/2 ton P/U's and SUV are over rated. Rating used to be conservation until mid 90's and then the two ratings wars started. A prime example. I have a 2000 K3500 SRW std cab P/U with 10 ply tires, proven 4L80 and 14 bolt rear axle and a conservative 9200 GVW (is has more springs than a 2500HD with same GVW) and massive brakes and it is "rated" at about 8000 lbs (I have towed 13k plus with it with no real issues) and yet a 2006 1/2 ton pick with car like tires, springs that are a bit of a joke, a lot less brakes and tiny axles was rated to tow more that 8K...
quote:
Originally posted by batch
I have exceeded the towing capacity of my vehicle as well and I have damaged it in the process. Just because you have done something doesn't make it a good idea.
If you damaged it is is because you did not know what you were doing and or had not properly setup vehicle. I used to tow 23K grain trailer to mill in 70's with a 3/4 ton GMC 4x4 with a 350 and a SM465 and did it for years and never broke anything. If you understand the dynamics involved and deal with them you can do it without damage. Typically people fry trannies because they do not add aux cooling, over heat motors because cooling is not up to task, break axle from towing big trailers with big tires on tiny axles, have too tall of axle ratio for load and overheat engine and or tranny, fry brakes because they do not believe in trailer brakes and so on. I just purchased a very HD cargo trailer with two 7K axles and a 15K GVW rating. The only change I may make to my K3500 is install a set of 4.56 gears I have on shelf as it already has a class 5 hitch on it. 1200 to 1500 lbs tongue weight on that truck is not a problem and it has the springs, tires and chassis to handle it fine without a WD hitch. (this is why I buy one ton P/U's because I can get into some serious stuff sometimes)
quote:
Originally posted by batch
Of course with the revised gearing you will have to contend with speedo error. Not a big deal but it is worth considering.
Speedo error are not hard to fix properly
quote:
Originally posted by batch
I towed my ATV trailer with a 6 cyl Grand Cherokee for several years before buying a full sized truck. I can say without question that it is much easier to tow now than it was then.
Well it likely had a 3.31 axle ratio and if you had 31's or so on it I have no doubt it lacked in towing a lot at times. If it had had a 4.10 in it you would have had a different opinion as far as towing power.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
I don't know if his trailer has brakes or not. I would assume that it is a tandem axle with brakes at 4100 lbs but he didn't mention a brake controller. They could be surge brakes but again - it wasn't mentioned so i assumed the worst.
Some trailer makers only put brakes on one axle to save cost and I would not advise that with his tow rig, he wants/needs brakes on both axles...
quote:
Originally posted by batch
I am not faulting your math but given a choice between a small vehicle and a big vehicle to tow a trailer I will take the big vehicle.
We are not talking about a 6 or 8K trailer behind his rig. I would not suggest a trailer over about 5K or so loaded weight with his rig V8 or 6 regardless of gearing because of tow vehicle chassis limitations in emergency conditions. |
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fourwd1
Street Queen
Posts:57
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| 09/07/2007 7:56 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by batch
I am not faulting your math but given a choice between a small vehicle and a big vehicle to tow a trailer I will take the big vehicle.
X infinity, you make so many valid points.
Sometimes math and reality don't mix. |
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- as seen in Four Wheeler magazine July 2006, Off-Road magazine Feb 2007
'84 4Runner SR5 - ARBed 5.29's F&R, 4.7 & 2.28 t-cases, drv trn lift, Chevy's, 30 spline Longs, BudBuilt skid, 36" TSLs... |
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fourwd1
Street Queen
Posts:57
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| 09/07/2007 8:00 PM |
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| And the bottom line is, there is no substitution for cubic inches.
Towing with any frequency requires CID (that's Cubic Inch Displacement for the mathematicians), or the vehicle will suffer in the long haul. |
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- as seen in Four Wheeler magazine July 2006, Off-Road magazine Feb 2007
'84 4Runner SR5 - ARBed 5.29's F&R, 4.7 & 2.28 t-cases, drv trn lift, Chevy's, 30 spline Longs, BudBuilt skid, 36" TSLs... |
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batch
Street Queen
Posts:117
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| 09/07/2007 11:09 PM |
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Thanks for the support Fourwd.
At the end of the day either option is viable. I wouldn't personally go for the bigger vehicle but that is just me. Changing the gears will probably work just fine.
Ultimately there are a lot of variables to consider here that we are not privy to. How much does Joey want to spend. How attached is he to his 4Runner. What are his future needs (more people?).
If he really likes his current rig - which is understandable since the previous gen 4Runner is a nice looking and very capable vehicle with a silky smooth V6 - then stick with it.
If he was looking for a change of pace - a lot of people do - then this is a good excuse to upgrade.
Either way will probably work. |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/08/2007 5:19 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by fourwd1
And the bottom line is, there is no substitution for cubic inches.
Towing with any frequency requires CID (that's Cubic Inch Displacement for the mathematicians), or the vehicle will suffer in the long haul.
No, the REAL bottom line is matching engine power curve to load with proper gearing. If I had to choose between towing with a V6 and some deep axle gears and a V8 with tall stock gears I would take V6 setup. When you properly setup a tow vehicle you need to pay a LOT of attention to axle ratios which many never do as like this poster above that focuses on displacement. Also, another benefit of deeper gear is that is reduces drive line strain and extends tranny life in severe duty because average torque load on it is reduced. SO many lift their trucks and never regear and never give a second thought to added strain on drive line from this. Towing is similar. BTW, you will no likely believe this, when I used to drive dump trucks in 70's, there was this old retire guy that used to do some contract hauling for us on big jobs when we would hire all the trucks with could find. He had a 58 C60 dump truck that was 100% stock and original paint to. It was in great shape and it had a 261 inline six and a 8 speed ( a SM420 and a 2 speed rear axle) He used to haul 8 ton loads of gravel and black top with it regularly with no real problems. I kick myself for not buying it off him for 900 bucks back then and parking it in the barn. |
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batch
Street Queen
Posts:117
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| 09/08/2007 10:42 AM |
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OK Snoman you win. You are smarter than me. It makes a lot more sense to modify an existing vehicle to exceed its towing capacity than it does to buy a vehicle that is rated to do more. Especially when you consider that once you have installed a tranny cooler and gears you have probably spent about the same as it would have cost you to just upgrade the vehicle to one of a similar vintage.
Does anyone have a Suzuki Samurai they would be willing to trade for a 1/2 ton Dodge Ram Quad Cab with a 5.9L and a towing package. I need it to tow my ATV trailer. I will need gears but apparently everything else will work just fine.
I would also be willing to trade for a 30 or 40 year old pick up truck with a straight six. If someone has an old Ford like the Sanford and Son truck that would be great. Once I get the gears in it I will probably have to red line it get it down the the highway at 70MPH and the old drum brakes will work great but that is ok. As long as I have gears it should work just fine.
(I hope you can sense the sarcasm because I am laying it on pretty thick)
For the record - I don't disagree with the physics. You are correct in stating that shorter gears will create less strain on the drive train than a bigger engine with taller gears. I don't deny that. My suggestion is to purchase a vehicle that is more capable. If you get a larger vehicle with a towing package you will probably get the gears AND the engine for less that what you would have spent to have the new gears and the tranny cooler installed.
By the way - The damage I did to my truck by exceeding it's towing capacity had nothing to do with me "not knowing what I was doing". The brake caliper worked itself loose and the CV boot popped off. I don't know how it happened but it did on the day that I was towing a very large trailer. It never happened before and it hasn't happed since so I can only assume that it had SOMETHING to do with towing the trailer.
That said - I will concede that the gear swap in the 4Runner will probably work. It just isn't the way I would go.
You can continue to argue the point if you want but I am done. Have a great weekend. |
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fourwd1
Street Queen
Posts:57
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| 09/08/2007 3:56 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by batch
Thanks for the support Fourwd.
No problem, when you're right, you're right.
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- as seen in Four Wheeler magazine July 2006, Off-Road magazine Feb 2007
'84 4Runner SR5 - ARBed 5.29's F&R, 4.7 & 2.28 t-cases, drv trn lift, Chevy's, 30 spline Longs, BudBuilt skid, 36" TSLs... |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/08/2007 4:11 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by batch
OK Snoman you win. You are smarter than me. It makes a lot more sense to modify an existing vehicle to exceed its towing capacity than it does to buy a vehicle that is rated to do more. Especially when you consider that once you have installed a tranny cooler and gears you have probably spent about the same as it would have cost you to just upgrade the vehicle to one of a similar vintage.
The whole flaw in your argument is that towing ratings with new 1/2 ton type SUV's is VERY subjective. There was a time when you order a twoing package and you got serious gears and suspension beef ups even in a 1/2 ton but those days are gone. If you are a seasoned and wise tower you do not pay much attention to factory ratings on some models and instead you do the math and check the gear ratios and such. There was a time when 1/2 ton trucks with 6 banger came with 4.10's and 3/4 tons with 4.57's and they had no OD. Toady they install much taller axle ratios and OD (rather than keeping a deeper ratio for power and using OD to cruise) and inflate tow ratings will doing it.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
Does anyone have a Suzuki Samurai they would be willing to trade for a 1/2 ton Dodge Ram Quad Cab with a 5.9L and a towing package. I need it to tow my ATV trailer. I will need gears but apparently everything else will work just fine.
What are you reaching for straws here? Must be because now you are down from a 180 HP or so SUV to a 70 or 80 HP 4 banger and a 2000 lb SUV as a tow tug!!!
quote:
Originally posted by batch
I would also be willing to trade for a 30 or 40 year old pick up truck with a straight six. If someone has an old Ford like the Sanford and Son truck that would be great. Once I get the gears in it I will probably have to red line it get it down the the highway at 70MPH and the old drum brakes will work great but that is ok. As long as I have gears it should work just fine.
(I hope you can sense the sarcasm because I am laying it on pretty thick)
My old 66 would top out around 85 to 90 with 4.57 gears but it could cruise 65 or 70 as long as you wanted. Yes back then we had no OD but the silly part is today they do have OD's and they could put some good gears in them (or you can yourself) for power and still have OD cruise. That is the point I am making that you seem to miss in your frustration. GM used to offer up to 5.13 gear option in HD pickups through 2000 when last old style pickup were built. When they came out with Dmax that stopped it at 4.10 for gas trucks to limit serious towing limits with gas motors to make $6K Dmax option look better.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
For the record - I don't disagree with the physics. You are correct in stating that shorter gears will create less strain on the drive train than a bigger engine with taller gears. I don't deny that. My suggestion is to purchase a vehicle that is more capable. If you get a larger vehicle with a towing package you will probably get the gears AND the engine for less that what you would have spent to have the new gears and the tranny cooler installed.
If you do your homework you will find that in last 10 years or so Detroit in general has inflated tow rating while using taller axle ratios. The "problem" is that there is no state, industry or federal standard on what proper towing performance is so they are pretty uch free to do as they please on rating and many who have not been around since the dinosaurs like me have accepted using second gear on highway grades as acceptable because they do not know any better and "assume" it is normal.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
By the way - The damage I did to my truck by exceeding it's towing capacity had nothing to do with me "not knowing what I was doing". The brake caliper worked itself loose and the CV boot popped off. I don't know how it happened but it did on the day that I was towing a very large trailer. It never happened before and it hasn't happed since so I can only assume that it had SOMETHING to do with towing the trailer.
A larger trailer would not cause caliper to work loose unless it was not installed correctly. The towing had nothing to do with it as at worst it would had overheated them.
quote:
Originally posted by batch
That said - I will concede that the gear swap in the 4Runner will probably work. It just isn't the way I would go.
It is a surer cure than just a bigger engine in present vehicle
quote:
Originally posted by batch
You can continue to argue the point if you want but I am done. Have a great weekend.
I do not consider this a argument but rather a extended debate. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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Joey01
Bone Stock
Posts:7
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| 09/09/2007 7:25 AM |
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| Wow, this is aq lot of information and i'm somone that has no mechanical knowledge. There seems to be an argument of whether or not I should modify my 4runner or get a V8. Considering I don't owe anything on my truck, I really wanted to stay away from car payments. However, I just learned something new over the weekend too. My manual says to not exceed 9200.bx for my Gross weight overall on my truck. However, with a dry camper of 4100lbs(yes, electric brakes), distribution bars/sway bar added, transmission cooler added, the sticker on my truck inside door says GVWR is 5250. Now that seems like i have a lot of weight on my truck. weird thing is, the only trouble I had was getting up a long steady hill on the highway. but I take it slow, DON"T have to push the petal to the metal, just give it some gas and leave the O/D off. My gauge stays cool. I'm up in the air about the whole thing. I guess everyone will have their preference and I've got to make the best guess on what to do. |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/09/2007 7:39 AM |
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| There is GVW and GCWR. Gross Vehicle Weight and Gross Combination Vehicle Weight (car and trailer) They are two different things. GCWR is kinda subjective because what is safe and effective in flat lands in a different matter in hills. Realistically they should have two GCVW's on most of them, one for relatively flat lands and another for hilly or mountainous areas. Your primary concern towing is heat of drive train and if it keeps its cool and you take your time on grades you will not have any big surprises. If you find it running warm on a long climb, dump the A/C and do install a small aux tranny cooler regardless of whether you regear or not. It is very cheap tranny insurance. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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Joey01
Bone Stock
Posts:7
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| 09/09/2007 7:49 AM |
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| is an aux tranny cooler different from a transmission cooler? |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 09/09/2007 9:00 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Joey01
is an aux tranny cooler different from a transmission cooler?
Does it have a aux external tranny cooler? (one other than one in radiator) |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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fourwd1
Street Queen
Posts:57
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| 09/09/2007 2:06 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Joey01
is an aux tranny cooler different from a transmission cooler?
An auxiliary cooler would typically be mounted in front of the radiator, along with the AC condenser if you have AC.
The stock cooler uses the radiator. |
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- as seen in Four Wheeler magazine July 2006, Off-Road magazine Feb 2007
'84 4Runner SR5 - ARBed 5.29's F&R, 4.7 & 2.28 t-cases, drv trn lift, Chevy's, 30 spline Longs, BudBuilt skid, 36" TSLs... |
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Joey01
Bone Stock
Posts:7
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| 09/10/2007 4:25 AM |
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| Well i had one installed at the RV place, and yes, it's on the front of the radiator. It's a transmission cooler. |
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