ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/07/2007 12:13 AM |
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| My Haynes manual is telling me to put both the Cam sprocket and the Crank sprokets at 6 O'clock (the timing marks that is).And then put the chain on and bolt everything up. But I would figure since the crank shaft has spun a bunch, it is no longer near where it needs to be in relation to the Cam. So do I still just put both timing marks at 6 O'clock like it is telling me? Or do I put them so the cam is at 6 and the crank is at 12? |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/07/2007 12:36 AM |
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| So if I get this straight... I need to put the #1 piston at TDC. Then put the gear on the crankshaft. and the timing mark should already be at 12 O'clock. Then align the cam gear so that the timing mark is at 6 O'clock. Then button it all up. Is this right? that is pretty much the reagular way of doing it then.... I have just never installed a Timing set in a motor in the truck.. For some reason I thought it would be different. I think I am going crazy here...lol |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/07/2007 5:24 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ChevyMan0784
I guess it could be a 350, there is just no telling with out looking up the motor numbers which are buried in grease.
Actually there is via casting number on drivers side top rear on block behind head. Check out link below
http://forum.snoman.com/viewtopic.php?t=129 |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/07/2007 5:31 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ChevyMan0784
So if I get this straight... I need to put the #1 piston at TDC. Then put the gear on the crankshaft. and the timing mark should already be at 12 O'clock. Then align the cam gear so that the timing mark is at 6 O'clock. Then button it all up. Is this right? that is pretty much the reagular way of doing it then.... I have just never installed a Timing set in a motor in the truck.. For some reason I thought it would be different. I think I am going crazy here...lol
Actually it can be number 1 or number 6 as they both hit top dead center at same time. The crank shaft turns twice for every one time cam turns and this is why you can have two TDC's per cam revolution. It does not matter which one you use because when the cam is timed to it via lining up marks it will be correct. |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/07/2007 10:16 AM |
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| So what I said about the timing mark alignment is correct right? |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/07/2007 1:19 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ChevyMan0784
So what I said about the timing mark alignment is correct right?
Yes, just pull it through a complete cam rev after doing it and make sure that it still lines up perfectly. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/07/2007 8:22 PM |
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| Is it common for the Balancer bolt to strip out? I was tightening it down when it got real stiff, like it was done. But I noticed that the pully wasnt lined up right, so I proceeded to tighten it when it started to get easy to turn. Is it possible it was hung up? Or do you think I striped it out? I was putting considerable force on it. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/07/2007 10:39 PM |
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| I just dont want to continue tightening and have the bolt snap. Its seemed like a tough bolt with fine threads, so I wouldn't figure it to strip or snap.... I have never had it happen. But I have always used new stuff. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/08/2007 4:12 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ChevyMan0784
I just dont want to continue tightening and have the bolt snap. Its seemed like a tough bolt with fine threads, so I wouldn't figure it to strip or snap.... I have never had it happen. But I have always used new stuff.
Take bolt out and inspect it to see if threads are clean or signs of being stripped. It you do not align damper correctly it can cause bolt to bind really hard and then ease up when damper aligns itself under bolt pressure. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/08/2007 2:39 PM |
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| Well, bad news for me. I must have over tightened it because it is completely stripped out. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 04/08/2007 3:46 PM |
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oh man... that is bad news. You do realize that the femal threaded part, is a hole drilled logitudinally into the crank shaft, right?
You could *try* to drill it out and tap it with a black-iron type tap (extremely hard steel), but I think you're going to need to pull hte oil pan off, undo the connecting rods, the main caps, and have the crank drilled and tapped professionally. yikes...
That is unless, someone has an idea I've not heard of.
Sorry man,
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/08/2007 4:28 PM |
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| Yea, at this point this is how it is going to go: #1. Grab a bottle of Guinness
#2. Clean up tools.
#3. Find Shop space.
#4. Rip this effing piece of dog crap of a 305 out of my freaking truck and send it and all related accessories to the crusher, where I will be waiting to push the big red CRUSH button. After which I grab that Corvette motor I have and stuff her neatly between my framerails with brand new parts. (yaya, noisy gears here I come). With a nice Holley Projection unit that I got brand new with everything for about 500 bucks. I am so sick of this motor it is sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo freaking gone!!!!!!!!!! |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/08/2007 5:11 PM |
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| There is not need to panic here. You are not the first one to do this. Simply mic the bolt and go to the next size or so larger in metric (you want it about 30 to 40 thousandths bigger) and get a Cobalt tap and it will easily recut the threads in the crank. The trick here is proper sizing and a very hard tap. That should be a cast steel crank (not forged) so it is not hard to retap. This is not a big problem and do not make it into one. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/08/2007 5:40 PM |
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| Yea, it is just not worth the trouble. It has been a long few days in the rain working on this thing. Plus this engine is a bit tired, and I would like to up the anty anyway. So I think I am going to just put my new motor in it. But I will consider tapping the crank first. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/08/2007 6:35 PM |
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| Tap it, it is not a big deal just buy a cobalt tap. I good steel on might work but Cobalt is much harder than crank and will cut it better. (Cobalt drill bits will easily drill thru hardened steel and stainless steel too) |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 04/08/2007 7:33 PM |
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LMAO! I just got through reading that thread - that's really funny ChevyMan! Sorry... I'm not laughing at you, but your itemized list of tasks is just damn funny!
Snoman does have a good point though (as usual)... try tapping the crank before you throw in the towel. A good tap will run you about $25, which is certainly cheaper than building a new motor. Plus, if you get your 305 running, you can still go wheeling, and build your new mill in your spare time! :)
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/08/2007 8:58 PM |
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| Yea yea, you guys are right. I just get so frustrated when one thing after another goes wrong. Ya'll know what I am talking about I am sure. Just not having a garage is really starting to get to me. I will go buy a cobalt tap, is there any other things I will need for this project? And I assume I will need to remove the radiator for this one, right? And is there a specific sized to go with for the new bolt, or just go one size or two up? |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 04/08/2007 10:26 PM |
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I can't tell you how many times I've been there with you! One thing breaks, then another, and another. It sucks.
Anyhow, get some good cutting oil (Marvel Mystery Oil, etc.) when you're running your tap. In a pinch, you can use WD40, just use a lot of it. You should have to remove your radiator, just lay underneath the rig, with the dampener off, and you can run it in that way.
If you have a micrometer, go about .250 - .300" oversize on the bolt (metric will likely be the next size up). Make sure you use a Grade 8 (it's actually called 10.9 in metric), fine thread bolt though.
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/08/2007 10:31 PM |
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| Ok, sounds good. I will just have to find some where that sells those exact things. I have had trouble finding them in the past. I dont have a Micrometer, so I will have to take the old bolt to the shop with me no doubt. Will just a regular corded drill work ok for this? Or do I need something special. I wouldnt imagine I would....but you never know. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/09/2007 5:36 AM |
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You do not need a drill to use a tap. The only reason you would use a drill is if you need to make hole larger. Taps come is a few cuts. a starting tap (which you need) and a finishing tap (which you may need if hole is not deep enough) which can thread down to bottom of hole. The usually make a "middle" taps which is a cut between the two also. Get a a starting tap. Also threads come in fine and course and you want fine. You might even stop by a machine shop with bolt and get some free advice on needed taps size and source for tap. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 04/09/2007 7:59 PM |
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P.S. Don't go with an el-cheapo $4 tap either!!! You'll really regret it in the long run and it will likely break off in the hole (ok - that sounded bad), then you'll have yet another problem to deal with.
When working a tap, use copious oil. Run the tap in 1/2 to 3/4 turn, then back off a 1/2 turn, then go in 1 full turn, back off 1/2 turn, etc. Keep doing this so that the tap can effectively clean out the metal it's cutting. It will take 15 minutes of so, but it's easy enough to do - just time consuming.
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/09/2007 9:06 PM |
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| Cool, I will definately take care to get a good tab set. I am going to put it off for a couple of days, but should get to it this weekend. Thanks alot guys. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/09/2007 9:45 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by webby4x4
P.S. Don't go with an el-cheapo $4 tap either!!! You'll really regret it in the long run and it will likely break off in the hole (ok - that sounded bad), then you'll have yet another problem to deal with.
There is no such thing as a el-cheapo Cobalt tap. They are kinda top of the line. Not only do they cut better, they are harder to break too. Also when you tap you always going in about 1 to 1 1/2 turns then back a 1/4 to 1/2 turn to clear the threads when it starts cutting a lot. |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/10/2007 1:48 AM |
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| Haha, for some reason I cant find Cobalt sets online. Do you guys know of some good websites where I can edumacate myself on taps? That is one thing that has been pounded into my head by several people, the whole backing it out thing to clean the threads. It makes sense and I remember learning it in shop class back in highschool, lol. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/10/2007 4:15 AM |
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What kind or sets can you find (what are they made out of?) Try this link
http://www.thomasnet.com/products/taps-cobalt-steel-83822452-1.html |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 04/11/2007 12:56 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by SnoMan
There is no such thing as a el-cheapo Cobalt tap...
Yeah, I know... I have a full set of SAE Cobalt taps. I wasn't suggesting that there was a cheaper version of Cobalt taps, I was cautioning that when buying a single tap, it might be tempting to save $20 and buy an el-cheapo Auto Zone tap, which will likely do a poor job at best. |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/17/2007 1:54 AM |
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Thank you Webby and SnoMan, for the great help. I really appreciate it, and to show my appreciation...I ran over a Malibu for you. and here is the pic!
Image Uploaded To Thread:
[img]http://www.4x4review.com/discussions2/uploaded/chevyman0784/20074171535_truck 1.jpg[/img]
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 04/17/2007 7:46 PM |
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Oh man - that's awesome! Glad you got it running again!!!
Did you end up tapping the crank? (man... that sounds perverse!) |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/17/2007 7:56 PM |
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| hehe, no actually believe it or not... I have not tapped the crank. I have been mudding the snot out of it for the last 3 days, and running over junkers. And it is unbelievably holding up. Soooo, I will be building that other motor up quick. This motor is really sluggish with the TH400 and NP205. I noticed a HUGE performance drop with that changeover. So I need more ponnies |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 04/17/2007 8:32 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ChevyMan0784
This motor is really sluggish with the TH400 and NP205. I noticed a HUGE performance drop with that changeover. So I need more ponnies
I suspect you need deeper gear more than a motor upgrade. Also if you did not use the correct torque converter for a small motor it would stall at a lower RPM and make it feel even more sluggish at times. (deeper gears would overcome this) |
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--------------------------
Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 04/17/2007 8:54 PM |
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| Yea, the whole set up came out of a 3500 one ton wit a 350 in it, including the torque converter. But my truck had plenty of power when it had the 700 and the 208, since they are lower geared, I know that the change out is the cause. But I know I want to do 5:13s when I get off the slope next time. I will be up for 6 weeks, so it will be awhile though.... |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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