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cheaperrooter
Body Lift
Posts:152
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| 12/29/2006 4:49 PM |
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Do I have to change the front axle too? Please say NO. About what would it cost me to get it done somewhere, and is it a do it yourself job? I am a plumber. Very mechanical. But I HATE working on veicles anymore. One last question. And its an important one too.
IF I GO BACK DOWN TO 225 (BOUGHT THE TRUCK WITH 265 ON IT) WILL THIS TRUCK FEEL THE SAME AS 265 WITH 4.56? In other words, if I am not looking to crawl thru some gumbo clay with it, am just looking for normal 4 wheel driving, is 225 with 3.42 equal to 265 tih 4.56? |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 12/29/2006 6:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by cheaperrooter
Do I have to change the front axle too? Please say NO. About what would it cost me to get it done somewhere, and is it a do it yourself job? I am a plumber. Very mechanical. But I HATE working on veicles anymore. One last question. And its an important one too.
IF I GO BACK DOWN TO 225 (BOUGHT THE TRUCK WITH 265 ON IT) WILL THIS TRUCK FEEL THE SAME AS 265 WITH 4.56? In other words, if I am not looking to crawl thru some gumbo clay with it, am just looking for normal 4 wheel driving, is 225 with 3.42 equal to 265 tih 4.56?
First you MUST change both axles when regearing. Next it is not hard to do with right tools and ability to follow instructions and a bit of patience (you may need to take it apart a few times to get mesh pattern correct) Last question, 225's with a 3.42 is about the same feel as 265 with 3.73's. Make no mistake, it was a cruel joke on GM's part to ship the truck with 3.42's. It should have never shipped that way. BTW. you would have to go to about a 26 inch tires with a 3.42 to get the ruff equivlent of 265's with a 4.10 or about a 23 inch tire to equal 265's with 4.56's (not much ground clearance and it would look funky too) |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 12/30/2006 9:19 PM |
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For what it's worth, I've set up about 20-30 sets of axle gears in the past and it's an all-day task for someone to do it in the garage.
You'll need some of the following tools:
- Dial-guage with magnetic mount (you can get a set at harbor freight for about $30-$40 and they'll work just fine)
- Patience
- Torque wrench
- Patience
- Rachet/Sockets and wrenches
- Patience
- Very big screw driver or medium sized pry bar
- Patience
- Gear pattern grease (Persian blue or the yellow stuff works too)
- Did I mention patience?
The long and short of it is this... you'll need several sheets of paper as you'll need to move shims from side to side to get the gear pattern right. You'll need to set the shims on both the ring gear and on the pinion gear (KEEP YOUR OLD CRUSH SLEEVE!!!!!!!!!!!! You'll use the old crush sleeve over and over again until you get your shim packs just right, then, and only when you are absolutely sure that your pattern is right, will you use the new crush sleeve.)
Expect that you'll take the better part of a morning and afternoon to set up your first gear set, since you're new at it. I would suggest that you do the front axle first, since that axle is less critical, and if you only get the pattern close, it'll be ok since you don't use the front axle that much, and you won't use it at highway speeds. You should still try to get it right, but since you'll essentially be learning on an axle, it's best to do it on the one that will see the least use.
Anyhow, I highly recommend that you call Randy's Ring and Pinion (http://www.ring-pinion.com/). We use their axles, gears and other stuff almost exclusivel here at 4x4review.com and I've used their stuff personally for the last 10 years. ALSO, when you buy gear sets from them, they'll include a VERY comprehensive installation pack (it includes bearings, gear pattern grease, a large shim pack, and much more). Give them a call and tell them that Rick from 4X4REVIEW.COM sent you.
Oh yeah, Randy's Ring and Pinion also includes (in my humble opinion) the best do-it-yourself instructions I've seen from any gear company - it'll make life much easier on you, that's for sure.
P.S. - We're in no way affiliated with Randy's, we've just used them for years and they treat everyone very well.
Snoman hit the tire-size topic right on the head, so I won't go into any detail on that.
P.S.S. - you'll probably save $250-$500 doing gears yourself!
Good luck, and let us know if you have any other questions.
Happy New Year,
Rick
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
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'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 12/30/2006 9:23 PM |
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P.S.S. - I agree with Snoman's earlier post that you should go with at LEAST 4.10:1 gears. Personally, I'd go wtih 4.56:1 gears since you have a stick shift with O/D, and you'll really see the truck come to life (plus, the gears are the same price).
Regards,
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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cheaperrooter
Body Lift
Posts:152
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| 12/31/2006 12:43 AM |
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| Ok guys, that was great. Your input and details gets an excellent rating in my head. Did I mention I was a repair plumber with 30 years exp? Soooooo, if you are in need of advice in that area, feel free to ask me. I have to admit, you are scaring me though. Shims for that, less critical for this, think I'll buy the gears and pay someone to do it for me. Figure I'll let someone do what they do, and I'll plumb all day to make thier money. I am confused about ONE LAST thing. Of course, this in mind with the fact that I am NOT a mechanic, but thinking of it logically.....here goes. Why the front too? For normal driving 99% 2 wheel drive, it wouldnt matter. But lets say I engage the front axle. So the rear axle is turing the tires faster then the front. So what? When you turn a corner, that happens all the time, one tire faster then another. The only way I can see that it would matter would be if the rear and front axle were locked together. But if the transfer case puts out the same rotation for rear and front, then who cares if my front axle tires are spinning slower? You dont need to get too technical (Trying to be nice and save you from writing long letters to idiots like me who dont fully understand). IF you need too, just say "Shut up Louie, and TRUST us, it HAS to be done. I know, I know, you said that already SnoMan, but I am, afterall, apparently very hardheaded. |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 12/31/2006 5:42 AM |
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| If you gear the axle differently, the minute you put it in 4x4 the truck will bind up and not want to roll on a grippy surface (kinda like a tranny in two gear at once) and on a slick surface it will not really be controlable becuase the tires will be trying to turn at different speeds from front to back and one axle will skid or slip its tires all the time to make up for it. There is not differently between front and rear. One more thing, I think Rick left air tools off the list. I would not do a axle without them because a 3/4 inch impact can make short work of the sometimes ugly job or breaking the pinion nut loose and removing it. Also sometimes you can get lucky and get rear end setup on first try or two if you do your homwork or like Rick said it can be a all day affair if you do not. In some drive axles the gear sets are marked on pinion head for depth variance and if you read this on old and new gears and adjust shim pack and set backlash you can sometimes get right on the money with mesh pattern first try. Just changing gears is the "easiest" and changing bearings too makes it a lot harder because you have to start from scratch. Generally you do not need to change bearing just because you are in there unless drive axle has been neglected and failed. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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cheaperrooter
Body Lift
Posts:152
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| 12/31/2006 7:07 AM |
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| Geez, I hate this. Now of course I am looking into the 4.56 sets, and I am seeing "LOCKERS" offered with them. This is why I got out of 4 wheeling years ago. Its too damn enticing. I had a 2001 Chevy Z 4x4 p/u. It had factory locking rear axle. I dont know what kind, but it functioned flawlessly. I never had a problem with it locking when it shouldnt. Happen to know if thats available for my tuck? Oh course SnoMan and Rick, I am going with 4.56. Who Wouldn't. The power of a v8......looking under the hood to make sure its a 6......better I should say SnoMan is too damn enticing, but I am going to have to add some sort of locker. I mean, while I am in there paying someone to do this. Hopefully it will come as a bolt in set. |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 12/31/2006 10:56 AM |
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OH YEAH - I forgot one other tool you'll need... You'll need a hydraulic press to both pull off the old races/bearings, and press on the new ones on the pinion and carrier.
Regarding different gears front and rear - SnoMan (as usual), hit the nail on the head. What can, and likely, will happen, is that if you engage 4-wheel drive with different gear ratios front and rear - you'll explode the transfer case or break a u-joint on the drive shaft. There is no differentiation in a normal transfer case, since it's essentially just gear (or gear and chain) driven.
Regarding lockers - you know, I'm normally a BIG advocate for lockers, but if you have a pickup truck and you spend most of your time on the street, you should really stay away from it. Two reasons: 1) It will put a bit more stress on your stock drivetrain. 2) It will be nearly impossible to drive in wintery-mix or even on rainy days. In short, the back end will slide around like you're on ice.
If you plan on doing some wheeling in your truck, you can get a selectable locker (the best of all worlds). Eaton, Tractech (a.k.a. Detroit Locker), ARB and Ox Locker all make selectable lockers. With a selectable locker, you drive around with an open diff, and when you want to engage it, you simply push a button, or pull a lever and you have full traction to both tires. They're more expensive, but they're the cream of the crop.
Most reputable ring/pinion shops like Randy's or National Gear will sell full sets at a dramatically reduced rate, so you can order all of your parts, and then find a local shop to do the installation. Who knows... maybe you can do some plumbing work in trade... :)
Regards and Happy New Year! |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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