84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/14/2006 4:06 PM |
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hi,
I am new here and looking at a 1978 cj-7. I have a few questions for you all about it and what s a fair price. The jeep is a six cylander with the auto trans. what trans would this be?? it is a 3 speed. next the jeep is equpped with the Quadra trac option. how does it work? how well does it work? and is it good off road? i know it locks the drive lines together through a switch in the glove box and i know the jeep is normally full time 4x4.
The jeep needs
some minor floor and body work
needs rear diff work. were can i get quadra trac parts?
needs two front fenders
speedo cable.
jeep has
levi package
nice intror
body repainted white
little rust
new tires
so what do you think is a fair price for it??
Thanks for any help
here is a pic
Download Attachment: [url="http://www.4x4review.com/discussions2/uploaded/84 400/2006111416631_78_CJ7.jpg"][img]images/icon_paperclip.gif[/img] 78_CJ7.jpg[/url] <-- Filesize = 97.17 KB |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/14/2006 8:08 PM |
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| It has a THM400 which is a bullet proof tranny. That tranny has a output shaft unique to Quadratrac and not just any THM400 will replace it as it must have that output shaft. I have a 79 J20 with a Quadratrac and it is not impossible to find parts for. It is basically a pretty sturdy unit and I have never had to repaire mine in 21 years of ownership and it pushed snow for years. The fulltime aspect of it is great off road and I rarely every "locked" mine. There is part time convertion kits for it out there and you can even swap in Dana 18 using a adaptor from Novak if you want to convert to a conventional case as it has outputs in correct places to mate with diff offests used in Qtrac Jeeps. |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/14/2006 10:37 PM |
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thanks snow man were have i seen you before... hmmm i did find a rear end with al the internals on daves jeeps for 150 that is for the quadra trac. good deal? I am going to look at the jeep sat morning and really need to get some info asap. i was looking for some forms that had some good stuff and so far the other one seems to be the best but it is not like my chevy for. jeep guys are just diffrent i guess. i just thought that the quadra trac with no low range would not be as good as the dana 300 or somthing that you could shift. Anyways i am suprised it has the same tranny as the larger v8 jeeps and j trucks and wagoneers.
know of any othe rgood sites?
thanks |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/15/2006 4:33 AM |
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| There are basically two kinds of Jeep people out there. Those that will use any type or brand of drive train in their Jeep and those that try to keep a Jeep a Jeep (like me) meaning that they use engines type/brands and such that actually came with Jeeps. While some will disagree, a Chevy powered Jeep is not a Jeep. (I own a few GM 4x4's too and have for many years). For what it is worth, any AMC engine from later 70's on will bolt up to your tranny, all the way up to a AMC 401 and the tranny and Tcase will handle it. Jeep had limited resources and did not bother with lighter duty trannies and Tcases when using smaller engines for simplicity in building them. One "problem" you do have though is the rear axle. It likely has a AMC 20 (easy to tell by big gland nut on hub) which has 2 piece axles and the hub/spline area was prone to fail with big tires. There is a aftermarket conversion that converts them to a one piece axle and eliminates that problem completely. After this mod the AMC20 is a pretty stout axle that is easily the match of a D44 in rear. I do not have any links for Jeep forums handy because I have personally owned a few over last 20 plus years and know them well myself on the "stock" side of things. (I have one that I have owned since 1985) BTW, if you have a single speed Qtrac it is easy to converter it to a two speed with a simple bolt on of the reduction unit. (once you find one it takes about 10 minutes to install it and a while longer to install shifter for it. (Tcase design lets you remove a rear cover and spline stub and insert the reduction unit in its place) The reduction unit is smooth, fairly quiet running and strong too to as it is a planetary design and the first such Tcase to use this a design for low range. If you find a Qtrac in a boneyard you just simply unbolt the reduction unit and remove it as it take only a few minutes and you might look at a try to retrive the shifter for low range too while you are at it. |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/15/2006 5:09 AM |
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| thanks i have seen a few online as well for cheap money. just wondering if somthing like that would be worth it if i get the jeep. also i found a rear end from daves jeeps for about 150 dollars. I was told that because the quadra trac uses an extream off set on the rear pumkin that finding the right part can be difficult. is this true on cj's or is it diffrent for others? i know amc 20's are fairly comen but i heard that since the q trac uses this offset there are hard to find. thanks for all the help snowman |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/15/2006 6:01 AM |
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| Qtrac used a normal offset in front and a offset rear axle. There are a lot of offset rear axles out there in bone yards from Qtrac equipped vehicals because they are largly unwanted and not used in non Qtrac vehicles. My J20 has a offset D60 in the rear of it. If you upgrade a AMC 20 to one piece axles you are not likely to have any problems with it up to 35's or bit bigger on a CJ because it is pretty stout when modded. |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/15/2006 9:17 PM |
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| thanks agian for the info snoman. the more i look around i do see parts however i have yet to find forged rear axles for these. it seems strange to me that jeep went with the hub in the rear design in the first place. What would cause a rear end to become locked up? I am guessing it was in the diff itself and not somthing like a spun hub. Maybe somthing to do with the ring and pinon gears??? i have not bought the jeep yet just trying to figure about how much some of these parts would cost so i can factor that into how much i ioofer thanks alot for the help |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/16/2006 9:04 AM |
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| It depends on how it is locked. If the pinion flange does not turn then it is likley a seive bearing or damaged ring and pinion. Either case is not good. U sed yo have AMC 20 that was given to me but I got rid of it a year ago. It had come out of a Jeep with Q trac that was fine otherwise. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/16/2006 4:14 PM |
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ahh well thanks for the info snoman. i am banking on a bone yard rear end or i can get a complete one from daves jeep for 150.00 but i need to figure what is wroong first. if it is the ring and pinon that can be fixed
i am guessing somthing in the diff as the owner said it locked up. any ideas? also does any one make one peice forged axles for the quadra trac?
thanks for the help snoman |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/17/2006 5:05 PM |
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| If the ring and pinion is damaged or if bearings are seized I would not give even 50 bucks for it when you can get another rearend at a bone yard for less money and effort that needed to fix other one. If it is locked you do not want it unless maybe it is free and this way if you tear into it and it is too bad to fix you are out nothing but your time.I am not sue I understand your question on axles. The retrofit aftermarket upgrade for AMC 20 rear axle works with any AMC 20 rear axle period. |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/17/2006 5:49 PM |
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| yeah i am just not sure of the avalibility and don't want to pay money for a junk yard one if i can do an easy fix. The reason i ask about the amc 20 forged axle upgrade is because they ar off center and one axle is bigger then the other so i can't use the normal amc 20 kit. thanks |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/17/2006 6:16 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by 84 400
yeah i am just not sure of the avalibility and don't want to pay money for a junk yard one if i can do an easy fix. The reason i ask about the amc 20 forged axle upgrade is because they ar off center and one axle is bigger then the other so i can't use the normal amc 20 kit. thanks
Good point! A quick search revealed that National Drive Train sells them for all styles AMC 20 including Qtrac version. There may be other vendors too. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/17/2006 8:42 PM |
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| Thanks for the help Snoman. i really apreciate you taking your time to do the search. i wish this oard got some more action like JeepForum.com but ahh well. tomarrow is the day that my dad is gonna check it out for me. i really wish i could but i am in college and need to devote time to my studdies right now. i will have pictures and more info tomarrow. thanks for the help |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/18/2006 6:34 AM |
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| I have twin daughters that started college this fall and I know all about the studies (I was a college man myself once about a time) Just remember one thing, you pay for the piece of paper that is your degree weather you had a "A" or "C" minus average but what you learn is free so to speak and is limited only by how much you apply yourself to aquiring the knowledge offered. (A chemistry professor told us that in a lecture once years ago and it is very true indeed) |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/19/2006 12:49 AM |
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thanks sno man very good point indeed. i thought you might want to see some pictures of the project canidate in question. they can be seen through my post on this site. I thank you for any and all feedback you can give me. it would be somthing for me to wrench on over winter break and this coming summer sort of a drive and then fix up during the summer project.
thanks agaon
ian
Also sno man i gotta ask what your take on rust is? the floor on the drivers side is preety much not there. ho much would be too much. i have the abition and time
here is a pic
http://s65.photobucket.com/albums/h208/84400/?action=view¤t=cj7floorboardhole.jpg
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 11/19/2006 9:41 AM |
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That's a WHOLE LOTTA RUST! Wholly cow...
You can get replacement weld0in floorboads, but in my humble opinion (and sorry for coming into this conversation late), you would be better off with an aftermarket, replacement body for your Jeep. I've tackled several rust-bucket projects in my day and if you don't cut away all of the rust (I mean every last bit of it) and then treat the metal, it's like cancer and keeps coming back.
If you're in the rust-belt and plan on making this a daily driver, I would look at an aluminum body.
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
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'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/19/2006 9:56 AM |
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| Not so sure about that because the aluminum body of a steel frame in salt could disappear quickly to corrosion. Myself I am more concerned about frame than bady because body it easy to fix as long as you have a good solid frame under it. |
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Visit the SnoMan at
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/19/2006 7:19 PM |
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| well snow man i thought yoyu would be best to ask since your a plow man! And we all know how pplowing can lead to serious rust unless the trucks are kept up very well. i did find some tubs for sale locally for shot money and even some fiberglass ones too. thanks alot ! |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/20/2006 3:54 AM |
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| One of the first things you want to do is eye ball frame really good and see in any repair is needed before you do anything with body. Try frame heavily with rust converter and stop rust now!I saw a few areas that caused me some concern and warrant closer inspection. |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/20/2006 10:06 AM |
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| definatly snow man i know the frame is most important and that is were i would look first. it is not worth the effort if the platform is shot !!! thanks again ! |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/20/2006 10:08 AM |
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| would you recomend any products like por 15 or somthing from eastwood
/ when i here the works "rust encpsilater that scares me but converter is fine. thanks agoan |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/20/2006 4:30 PM |
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| I will tell you what I have used for almost 30 years and it works great for me. Used 90w or 140w gear oil put on warm with a paint spray gun. It gets into on the crack and stops rust now and it is tuff to wash off. I do it fall and spring with plow trucks and my old 79 J20 Jeep P/U which plowed snow for many years and seen tons of salt still has a solid frame with nothing more than a little surface rust in a few areas. No big serious scale. Had I not done this the frame would have been gone long ago. My plows look great using same trick too and even after 10 years for one as it looks better than some one year old plows I have seen rust wise. Not very scientific but it works for me. |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/21/2006 4:57 AM |
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| thanks for the tip and sounds like it makes sence to me but i am going to have to clean the frame and do somthing to it first, to treat the excisting rust. Would you recomend a paint to use? i was planning on wirewheeling as well as grinding to clean the frame and then coating with some kind of rust converter then rustolium heavly rusted primer and then a top 2 coats of rustolium glsyr black. or rubberized undercoating and then spraying an oil on it to keep mud and salt from sticking. what do you think? |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/21/2006 7:03 AM |
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| As primers go the only one I have had much luck with long term is red or ruddy brown (as some call it) primer applied in a couple of heavy coats aft lose scale it removes. You actualy want a rough surface for paint to adhere to. After it cures seal it with a good gloss rust resistant paint. Rust converter can work to but it to needs rust to convert to a new surface so leave some on there. On the undercoating, it is a mixed bag because if the metal is not realy dry under it(moisure wise) it can trap it in and make it rust more so it can go either way. THe gearoil trick will stop current rust were it is at and keep there it you reapply as needed. (it is easy to tell because little rust flake wil peak out through dried coating) Also after several years of treatment it kinda forms a hard film on metal left behind after the lighter parts of oil evaporate out that is even tuffer to remove. Gear oil actual has a antirust additive in it and is pretty tuff on rust. |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 11/21/2006 9:57 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by SnoMan
...The gearoil trick will stop current rust were it is at and keep there if you reapply as needed. (it is easy to tell because little rust flake wil peak out through dried coating) Also after several years of treatment it kinda forms a hard film on metal left behind after the lighter parts of oil evaporate out that is even tuffer to remove. Gear oil actual has a antirust additive in it and is pretty tuff on rust.
Snoman - you're kidding about rubbing gear oil all over your frame... right? |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 11/22/2006 12:03 AM |
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| Haha, actually Webby, I have heard of folks doing that. Only problem is the need to constantly reapply yearly. Por 10 works too. But if you dont feel like doing it yourself, there are a few options for bullet proof undercoating. These are, if you so happen to have your rig frame off(you probably dont), then you can take it down to somewhere that does bed liners(the softer polyurathane) and have it coated(be sure to tape off key components) or just have it undercoated. Pretty simple. An undercoating usually runs about 150-200 bucks...dont pay more. And if you have the frame all prepped out and taped off, then it should only cost you a few hundered to have it bed lined, I recomend Rhino Liner...I used to sell the stuf and have applied it myself and it works great. |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 11/22/2006 6:24 AM |
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yeah, perhaps. I have seen rust inside a third member before, so I'm not convinced that it forms a tough layer. Before I swapped axles in my Land Cruiser, I did an off-road trip and went through some water. A few weeks later I went to change the fluid and there was a nice rust line on the inside of the diff.
Plus, if you go down a dusty trail, dust will cake all over it, and it will hold water.
Am I wrong? I'm not trying to be argumentative, I just don't understand how / if this would actually work.
P.S. - I'm a Krylon kind of guy. If I go off roading and scrape up my frame, I just wipe it down and shoot it real quick. Takes 2-3 minutes and works perfectly (easy, and cheap). |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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ChevyMan0784
Lift & Lockers
Posts:699
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| 11/22/2006 10:37 AM |
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| Hahaha, yep....thats what I do! Usually I only have to worry about it once a year (everyting is frozen as is the rust on my truck!) Krylon is awsome....and it is tougher than some think. Especially if you use the Engine Paint type, it is also heat and cold resistant, plus it really sticks good!!! I have just seen quite a few people bring their trucks, jeeps, boats...etc. in to have the chassis bed lined...I have the inside of my blazer all done up with it. What you are saying about the gear oil makes sense. I don't know where I heard that....hmmm, maybe it was my buddy with the ford...! that explains it!!! |
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gimmie fuel gimmie fire gimmie that which I desire-James Hetfield
*Never give an Irish man good cause for revenge.
*Guns dont kill people, but they sure help!!
*98% OF AMERICANS SAY 'OH S**t' BEFORE GOING IN THE DITCH ON A ICEY ROAD.
THE OTHER 2% ARE FROM ALASKA, AND THEY SAY, 'HOLD MY BEER AND WATCH THIS |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 11/22/2006 11:35 AM |
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LOL! You and SnoMan may be (actually, probably are) correct. I just don't understand how it would work.
Anyhow, we're off on a tangent. ;)
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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SnoMan
Lift & Lockers
Posts:943
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| 11/24/2006 9:00 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by webby4x4
Snoman - you're kidding about rubbing gear oil all over your frame... right?
No except you spray it on with a paint spray gun and a air compressor. Been doing it for years and it works great. In cold weather warm oil up to were it is hot but not to hot to hold. The spray gun atomizes it some and it covers well. I use a fan spray nozzle spray gun to do it so I can control the position of a "fanned" spray on surface I am treating. I take one to two quarts depending on vehicle size and how through you are. I save my old gear oil in a 5 gallon bucket and the dirt/grit settles out of it and leaves resonably clean oil on top to pour off and spray on |
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Visit the SnoMan at
www.thesnoman.com |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/26/2006 12:14 PM |
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| thanks for all the tips here guys! good info i can use. the project has shifted and maybe i should start a new topic. Probobly going to pass on the cj as the frame had repaire done in the rear and it is an automatic.. i was hunting more and more like i do every day it seems and stumbled into a 1989 yj that is lifted 6 incch and has 33's and it is the manual trans and the 4.2. I know i know yj ewww.... but the tub is galvanized and almowt rust free. it has a new t case and tranny but does need some work! we test drove it and seemed nice for a lifted rig. i will add more later but am pretty tired right now. just wanted to update |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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webby4x4
Forum Admin, Magazine Editor
Rock Star
Posts:2375
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| 11/26/2006 3:09 PM |
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Good luck 84 400! Those YJ's are actually pretty darn good platforms to build 4-wheel drives.
Rick |
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Rick Webster
Editor, 4X4REVIEW.COM - A Tork Media, Inc. Publication
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
'74 FJ40 Land Cruiser
"Measure once, cut twice" |
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84 400
Bone Stock
Posts:17
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| 11/26/2006 6:41 PM |
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| Thanks alot. i have always and will always like the cj's better but money is a factor and yj's seem to be the best bang for buck. i will have a ic up here for all you to look at and alot more questions should i start a new thread??? |
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1984 chevy c10
sb 400 hooker headers comp cam eldebrock 650cfm thunder carb edelbrock preformer intake |
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